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	<title>Comments on: Weekend Open Thread</title>
	<atom:link href="http://deanesmay.com/2009/10/30/weekend-open-thread-20/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://deanesmay.com/2009/10/30/weekend-open-thread-20/</link>
	<description>Defending the liberal tradition in history, science, and philosophy.</description>
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		<title>By: Mc Kiernan</title>
		<link>http://deanesmay.com/2009/10/30/weekend-open-thread-20/#comment-179414</link>
		<dc:creator>Mc Kiernan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 20:56:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://deanesmay.com/?p=17747#comment-179414</guid>
		<description>Yer good John.   That&#039;s style of  the best order.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yer good John.   That&#8217;s style of  the best order.</p>
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		<title>By: John Eddy</title>
		<link>http://deanesmay.com/2009/10/30/weekend-open-thread-20/#comment-179358</link>
		<dc:creator>John Eddy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Nov 2009 23:42:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://deanesmay.com/?p=17747#comment-179358</guid>
		<description>Godot, I believe...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Godot, I believe&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin D.</title>
		<link>http://deanesmay.com/2009/10/30/weekend-open-thread-20/#comment-179354</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Nov 2009 15:38:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://deanesmay.com/?p=17747#comment-179354</guid>
		<description>Erm?  What was deleted?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Erm?  What was deleted?</p>
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		<title>By: Mc Kiernan</title>
		<link>http://deanesmay.com/2009/10/30/weekend-open-thread-20/#comment-179351</link>
		<dc:creator>Mc Kiernan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Nov 2009 02:15:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://deanesmay.com/?p=17747#comment-179351</guid>
		<description>I deleted the comment in favor of a more intelligent approach to the subject matter re:  conflicts between Kevin and Dean.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I deleted the comment in favor of a more intelligent approach to the subject matter re:  conflicts between Kevin and Dean.</p>
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		<title>By: greenwell</title>
		<link>http://deanesmay.com/2009/10/30/weekend-open-thread-20/#comment-179347</link>
		<dc:creator>greenwell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 16:39:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://deanesmay.com/?p=17747#comment-179347</guid>
		<description>Maybe all of us should chill a bit. It is, after all, only a blog.

Arnold, I&#039;m sorry for your loss. I have 6 siblings and I don&#039;t know how I would react if (when) I lose one of them. And speaking of memory, it&#039;s a funny thing. I&#039;m in my mid fifties, and as I get older, I am finding that my memory is more and more playing funny tricks on me. I can vividly remember things that happened when I was in first grade, but things that happened to me last week - or even yesterday sometimes - I haven&#039;t a clue. Remembering what you posted on Deans World a month ago just isn&#039;t important in the scheme of life.

Now, about the spat between Kevin and Dean. I completely understand where Kevin is coming from. He was treated very shabbily by Dean, so I get it and don&#039;t blame him for the attitude.

Now about Dean... Something is going on.  I have sensed a definite attitude change over the past few months, and it&#039;s not just the conservative vs liberal issues. I don&#039;t know exactly what the problem is, but it&#039;s not any of my business either. If he wanted us to know, he would have told us. Nonetheless, I have enjoyed the give and take of this blog and its regular commentators for quite a few years now, and I would mourn its passing. (I came here from &quot;Methuselah&#039;s Daughter&quot; back about 2003 or thereabouts. I enjoyed that site so much, I bought the book.)

Kevin, I understand where you are coming from. But it&#039;s obvious that you enjoy posting here on Deans World or you wouldn&#039;t have come back, even temporarily. So in that spirit, I hope you and Dean can reconcile when he returns. I enjoy reading your posts.

Now back to lurking...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe all of us should chill a bit. It is, after all, only a blog.</p>
<p>Arnold, I&#8217;m sorry for your loss. I have 6 siblings and I don&#8217;t know how I would react if (when) I lose one of them. And speaking of memory, it&#8217;s a funny thing. I&#8217;m in my mid fifties, and as I get older, I am finding that my memory is more and more playing funny tricks on me. I can vividly remember things that happened when I was in first grade, but things that happened to me last week &#8211; or even yesterday sometimes &#8211; I haven&#8217;t a clue. Remembering what you posted on Deans World a month ago just isn&#8217;t important in the scheme of life.</p>
<p>Now, about the spat between Kevin and Dean. I completely understand where Kevin is coming from. He was treated very shabbily by Dean, so I get it and don&#8217;t blame him for the attitude.</p>
<p>Now about Dean&#8230; Something is going on.  I have sensed a definite attitude change over the past few months, and it&#8217;s not just the conservative vs liberal issues. I don&#8217;t know exactly what the problem is, but it&#8217;s not any of my business either. If he wanted us to know, he would have told us. Nonetheless, I have enjoyed the give and take of this blog and its regular commentators for quite a few years now, and I would mourn its passing. (I came here from &#8220;Methuselah&#8217;s Daughter&#8221; back about 2003 or thereabouts. I enjoyed that site so much, I bought the book.)</p>
<p>Kevin, I understand where you are coming from. But it&#8217;s obvious that you enjoy posting here on Deans World or you wouldn&#8217;t have come back, even temporarily. So in that spirit, I hope you and Dean can reconcile when he returns. I enjoy reading your posts.</p>
<p>Now back to lurking&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: ArnoldHarris</title>
		<link>http://deanesmay.com/2009/10/30/weekend-open-thread-20/#comment-179344</link>
		<dc:creator>ArnoldHarris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 12:40:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://deanesmay.com/?p=17747#comment-179344</guid>
		<description>McK,

It was forgetfulness, not disingenuity. 

From late July until late October my family life was dominated by the last days of my younger sister and only sibling, Andrea Harris Supler. I had completely forgotten the details of Kevin&#039;s online struggle with Dean, and I have had little occasion over the years to look up my own old comments on Dean&#039;s World.

I had not spent much time with my sister for a number of years. Andrea was just 67 years old and approaching 68 in late July, when her surviving son called me on urgent business and told me his mom was in a local hospital with terminal bone cancer.  The latter was thought  to be from metastasization of an earlier bladder cancer. My wife and I, along with our three sons, our daughter and her fiance, all drove down to her visit with her in a hospital in Harvey, Illinois. That broke the ice, and we talked almost every day by telephone until her pain got bad enough to require large doses of morphine. 

She died on August 16, just eight days prior to her 68th birthday and one year short of what would have been her 50th anniversary of marriage to her husband Alex.

Since that weekend in July, my wife and I have had to put in five separate trips from Dane County, Wisconsin to the far southern end of Chicagoland; all on family business.  That&#039;s about 200 miles of driving in either direction -- 400 miles per day. But it marked my reconnection to my own extended but shrinking family, and it was and always will be important to me.

And the truth is, there have been many weeks in a row during these past three months in which I have had no time to given any thought whatsoever to Dean&#039;s World and all you good folks.
----
By the way. I have not lived in Chicago since late 1972. So I haven&#039;t had much need or opportunity for driving around on that city&#039;s streets. Accordingly the city traffic strangles that Stefi and I found ourselves in during our most recent visit to Andrea and Alex&#039;s place in the Town of Monee in northern Will County, Illinois, had to be experienced to be believed. We made the mistake of getting off the expressway system to drive to Lutz&#039;s cafe and konditerei on Montrose Avenue on the city&#039;s north side. Even on a late Saturday afternoon, the traffic inside the city seems like the worst rush hour traffic along Lake Shore Drive that I remember from 1967-1972, when I had to commute to downtown Chicago and back from a north side apartment. I don&#039;t think I&#039;d be able to take city living anymore. 

Arnold Harris
Mount Horeb WI</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>McK,</p>
<p>It was forgetfulness, not disingenuity. </p>
<p>From late July until late October my family life was dominated by the last days of my younger sister and only sibling, Andrea Harris Supler. I had completely forgotten the details of Kevin&#8217;s online struggle with Dean, and I have had little occasion over the years to look up my own old comments on Dean&#8217;s World.</p>
<p>I had not spent much time with my sister for a number of years. Andrea was just 67 years old and approaching 68 in late July, when her surviving son called me on urgent business and told me his mom was in a local hospital with terminal bone cancer.  The latter was thought  to be from metastasization of an earlier bladder cancer. My wife and I, along with our three sons, our daughter and her fiance, all drove down to her visit with her in a hospital in Harvey, Illinois. That broke the ice, and we talked almost every day by telephone until her pain got bad enough to require large doses of morphine. </p>
<p>She died on August 16, just eight days prior to her 68th birthday and one year short of what would have been her 50th anniversary of marriage to her husband Alex.</p>
<p>Since that weekend in July, my wife and I have had to put in five separate trips from Dane County, Wisconsin to the far southern end of Chicagoland; all on family business.  That&#8217;s about 200 miles of driving in either direction &#8212; 400 miles per day. But it marked my reconnection to my own extended but shrinking family, and it was and always will be important to me.</p>
<p>And the truth is, there have been many weeks in a row during these past three months in which I have had no time to given any thought whatsoever to Dean&#8217;s World and all you good folks.<br />
&#8212;-<br />
By the way. I have not lived in Chicago since late 1972. So I haven&#8217;t had much need or opportunity for driving around on that city&#8217;s streets. Accordingly the city traffic strangles that Stefi and I found ourselves in during our most recent visit to Andrea and Alex&#8217;s place in the Town of Monee in northern Will County, Illinois, had to be experienced to be believed. We made the mistake of getting off the expressway system to drive to Lutz&#8217;s cafe and konditerei on Montrose Avenue on the city&#8217;s north side. Even on a late Saturday afternoon, the traffic inside the city seems like the worst rush hour traffic along Lake Shore Drive that I remember from 1967-1972, when I had to commute to downtown Chicago and back from a north side apartment. I don&#8217;t think I&#8217;d be able to take city living anymore. </p>
<p>Arnold Harris<br />
Mount Horeb WI</p>
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		<title>By: Mc Kiernan</title>
		<link>http://deanesmay.com/2009/10/30/weekend-open-thread-20/#comment-179343</link>
		<dc:creator>Mc Kiernan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 05:14:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://deanesmay.com/?p=17747#comment-179343</guid>
		<description>But all this seems questionable to me because I don’t understand the specific issue or issues that you and Dean fought over. I was out of action here for a while, because my sister and only sibling died in northern Illinois back in August. I have the notion it may involve little more than a case of mutually bruised punctilio of the kind most of us slough off in the course of daily life.

Arnold,

You certainly were not out of action during  this thread:

http://deanesmay.com/2009/09/17/rosh-hashanah-the-shadow-of-things-to-come/

 which really involved the core  precipitating  issues.   So you are being a bit dis-ingenuous with your excuses above/ re: measures of integrity/ email privacy.

See here as well --- same thread ---  where it is actually September not August 2009 when you comment  on the very same issues. 

http://deanesmay.com/2009/09/17/rosh-hashanah-the-shadow-of-things-to-come/#comment-177932</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But all this seems questionable to me because I don’t understand the specific issue or issues that you and Dean fought over. I was out of action here for a while, because my sister and only sibling died in northern Illinois back in August. I have the notion it may involve little more than a case of mutually bruised punctilio of the kind most of us slough off in the course of daily life.</p>
<p>Arnold,</p>
<p>You certainly were not out of action during  this thread:</p>
<p><a href="http://deanesmay.com/2009/09/17/rosh-hashanah-the-shadow-of-things-to-come/" rel="nofollow">http://deanesmay.com/2009/09/17/rosh-hashanah-the-shadow-of-things-to-come/</a></p>
<p> which really involved the core  precipitating  issues.   So you are being a bit dis-ingenuous with your excuses above/ re: measures of integrity/ email privacy.</p>
<p>See here as well &#8212; same thread &#8212;  where it is actually September not August 2009 when you comment  on the very same issues. </p>
<p><a href="http://deanesmay.com/2009/09/17/rosh-hashanah-the-shadow-of-things-to-come/#comment-177932" rel="nofollow">http://deanesmay.com/2009/09/17/rosh-hashanah-the-shadow-of-things-to-come/#comment-177932</a></p>
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		<title>By: ArnoldHarris</title>
		<link>http://deanesmay.com/2009/10/30/weekend-open-thread-20/#comment-179340</link>
		<dc:creator>ArnoldHarris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 01:44:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://deanesmay.com/?p=17747#comment-179340</guid>
		<description>Kevin, I of all people do indeed understand hardnosed integrity in which an issue is fought to the limit.

But all this seems questionable to me because I don&#039;t understand the specific issue or issues that you and Dean fought over. I was out of action here for a while, because my sister and only sibling died in northern Illinois back in August. I have the notion it may involve little more than a case of mutually bruised  punctilio of the kind most of us slough off in the course of daily life.

If you want to explain your side of all this, let&#039;s do it privately so as not to re-open too many old wounds here on Dean&#039;s World. You have my online address from an email I sent you a couple of months ago. And I can be counted on to keep whatever confidences you require. Which is one of my measures of integrity.

Arnold Harris
Mount Horeb WI</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kevin, I of all people do indeed understand hardnosed integrity in which an issue is fought to the limit.</p>
<p>But all this seems questionable to me because I don&#8217;t understand the specific issue or issues that you and Dean fought over. I was out of action here for a while, because my sister and only sibling died in northern Illinois back in August. I have the notion it may involve little more than a case of mutually bruised  punctilio of the kind most of us slough off in the course of daily life.</p>
<p>If you want to explain your side of all this, let&#8217;s do it privately so as not to re-open too many old wounds here on Dean&#8217;s World. You have my online address from an email I sent you a couple of months ago. And I can be counted on to keep whatever confidences you require. Which is one of my measures of integrity.</p>
<p>Arnold Harris<br />
Mount Horeb WI</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin D.</title>
		<link>http://deanesmay.com/2009/10/30/weekend-open-thread-20/#comment-179339</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 00:37:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://deanesmay.com/?p=17747#comment-179339</guid>
		<description>Arnold,

I appreciate what you have to say but there are some matters of principle one doesn&#039;t negotiate.  I&#039;d think you of all people would understand this.

Dean crossed a line and I&#039;ve made myself clear on why I cannot look the other way on it.  Calling into question a thesis or argument is one thing.  Calling into question the integrity of the one putting forth a thesis or argument is another.  If he wishes to rectify the situation the ball is firmly in his court.  I&#039;m not demanding him to and should he choose not to I shall once again leave.

I am not angry with Dean and I still talk to him.  But principle is principle and I am able and willing to walk away again without hesitation.  This is Dean&#039;s blog.  He may say what he wishes on any topic whenever he wishes.  That doesn&#039;t mean I must be a party to it.

So, for now, I will stick around.  When Dean returns I will cheer then bow out, save for a change in Dean&#039;s position.  That&#039;s all there is to it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Arnold,</p>
<p>I appreciate what you have to say but there are some matters of principle one doesn&#8217;t negotiate.  I&#8217;d think you of all people would understand this.</p>
<p>Dean crossed a line and I&#8217;ve made myself clear on why I cannot look the other way on it.  Calling into question a thesis or argument is one thing.  Calling into question the integrity of the one putting forth a thesis or argument is another.  If he wishes to rectify the situation the ball is firmly in his court.  I&#8217;m not demanding him to and should he choose not to I shall once again leave.</p>
<p>I am not angry with Dean and I still talk to him.  But principle is principle and I am able and willing to walk away again without hesitation.  This is Dean&#8217;s blog.  He may say what he wishes on any topic whenever he wishes.  That doesn&#8217;t mean I must be a party to it.</p>
<p>So, for now, I will stick around.  When Dean returns I will cheer then bow out, save for a change in Dean&#8217;s position.  That&#8217;s all there is to it.</p>
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		<title>By: Mc Kiernan</title>
		<link>http://deanesmay.com/2009/10/30/weekend-open-thread-20/#comment-179338</link>
		<dc:creator>Mc Kiernan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Nov 2009 23:21:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://deanesmay.com/?p=17747#comment-179338</guid>
		<description>Well done, Arnold.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well done, Arnold.</p>
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