Here’s praying the President and the Congress get the job done this weekend, and pass this crucial legislation to help Americans who need it:
Word has it that the President is working the phones non-stop this weekend. God bless him.
Defending the liberal tradition in history, science, and philosophy.
Support Dean’s World
{ 37 comments }
I’m praying someone gets some balls and votes no in spite of all the bribery and arm twisting. I’ve worked in HC since I was 14 y/o and from my perspective every measure congress has made to improve things has always made delivering HC more problematic and more expensive.
My god Dean this is such a bad bill. Healthcare costs will skyrocket and the net result will be less care and less input from doctors and patients in decision making.
Even the honest Dems admit this is a bad bill but their hope is that people get so fed up they demand a single payer system to fix it.
This is f’d up.
and today I learn that they somehow put student loan language in the HC bill. WTF?? How’d that happen?
I think I will not pray that the baby killers succeed in corrupting the half-dozen remaining pro-life Democrats, at the cost of theirs souls and ours.
You may not do evil, so that good may come of it.
May the Lord Bless President Obama and all members of Congress, and grant them the wisdom and judgment to enact just laws that protect all human life.
I fully expect the flaws in the package to be addressed by future legislation. Right now I see the real holdup as being the people who just won’t admit that common defense against injury and illness is as important as common defense against invaders. We can then address things like abortion and other problems in the system.
And I don’t believe for a minute this is going to lead to Single Payer.
As for evil to do good: I think denying millions help they need is the greater evil, inaction is the greater evil.
This is a moral imperative. It needs to pass.
I’m just having a hard time seeing how 17,000+ enforcement agents are going to solve this issue. Honestly, do you really think “government” is going to create an easy to use system that is cost-effective?
The easiest thing to do would be to allow states to individually extend Medicaid to more people or increase funding to programs like the VA to capture the critically ill/chronic care patients.
There are better, cheaper ways to get coverage to those who do not have it and want it.
The Obama plan will result in higher costs, more dead people and less freedom, especially for poor people. Progressive policies work by stripping freedom and responsibility from the lower classes first, and then the middle class. (The upper classes always have all the freedom and resposibility they want.) Progressive policies infantalize, domesticate and finally enslave the poorest and the least powerful. Progressive policies are always fascist, and not in a good way.
I may often agree with your analysis of history, Dean, and sometime even with your policy ideas, but not his time. What Obama and the Democrats propose is pure theft and destruction of something valuable and unique.
I’m seeing a moral imperative to vote against this immoral bill.
Yours,
Tom
Dean
You know greater evil has nothing to do with it. That’s consequentialism. Killing babies to get healthcare is evil, and supporting it a mortal sin. You know this, I don’t have to tell you. Choosing otherwise is grave evil under clear doctrine.
Dean,
I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again…
It’s not going to turn out the say you think.
That’s a generic, safe statement.
Sadly, reality appears to be beyond the OODA of politics.
Oh, the consequences are pretty clear to anyone who can do math and doesn’t believe in unicorns. The nation cannot afford this bill. The mandate to purchase insurance is blatantly unconstitutional. The result? More taxes, more government control and more circumvention of the Constitution by our ‘enlightened’ leaders as they seek to help us in spite of ourselves.
Sorry, Dean, I think I understand your reasoning, but I don’t believe you’ve thought this one through. Then again, most supporters of this bill haven’t so it’s no surprise.
The nation cannot afford the way things are as they currently stand. It amuses me how so many of the people concerned about the potential cost of health care reform, never seemed to have much concern for the eventual multi-trillion dollar cost of the invasion of Iraq back in 2003. Time to get some priorities straight here, folks…
Cyrus,
Do you ever get the slightest hint that while GWB may have screwed up $$$ wise, but that the current President is about to deliver USA, Inc into financial disaster at the expense of the ppl and families and small business’s paying the taxes ?
And this abominable bill fixes it how, exactly? By creating layers of bureaucracy and unconstitutional mandates… yeah, that’s the ticket! Graft and nepotism for everyone! And waiting lists for care for the proles…
Now listen to this bullroar.
Prolife demobamacrats have assigned THE President of the USA to be in CHARGE of abortions in exchange for their vote. Unbelievable.
“Sunday: Rep. Bart Stupak, D-Mich., holds up an executive order to be signed by President Obama reaffirming a ban on the use of federal funds to provide abortions, an order Stupak says is enough to win his vote to pass the health insurance overhaul. ”
So abortion is now a function of executive order. Brilliant.
Don’t bother, but its here:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/03/21/stupak-says-health-care-deal-looming-abortion-funding/
Since comprehensive coverage and government mandates are the major contributors to the current high cost of medical care in this country – explain to me how expanding comprehensive coverage to all and increasing government mandates is going to control the rising cost of medical care?
We use too much medical care and waste too much money now on marginally effective treatments.
Dean, I have just one word to say to you:
Yahooooooooooo!!!!!!!
Mc Kiernan Wrote:
“Do you ever get the slightest hint that while GWB may have screwed up $$$ wise, but that the current President is about to deliver USA, Inc into financial disaster at the expense of the ppl and families and small business’s paying the taxes ?”
Unless you have more than 50 employees, this plan will not effect you tax-wise at all. If you have more than 50 employees and you currently do not have any insurance program for your business, you are taxing the resources of society as it is. Currently, someone making minimum wage with no insurance ends up using public services as well as private medical facilities that they cannot afford to pay back. It is killing the availability of the medical care system in our society through cost, as well as eating up the resources of our rather limited public services. All the while, you are laughing all the way to the bank. Sorry, but I am not here to pay for your “profit” when you have nothing to give in return. You deserve to get smacked with a $2000 dollar penalty per employee every year for such behavior. You are sucking that money out of your local community as it is.
On a side note…I always find it amusing how the best medial services I ever witnessed in action in my life…Was in the Army. Funny how that is, and how so many against this bill never have an argument to refute that.
Dean, regardless of the merits or lack of merit of this bill, if you can actually stomach the process that is being followed by the Democrats, you’ve pretty much lost all respect I ever had for you. This is banana republic stuff. Here we have a sitting President, whose constitutional duty is to enforce the laws as written promising to violate the statute in an executive order in order to get enough votes to pass the bill he is promising not to enforce.
This is historic all right. We are watching the end of Democracy as we know it.
Add to that the complete abomination that this bill actually is and now you’ve got the Congress and the President literally creating rules on the fly to pass a bill that is likely unconstitutional and is opposed by a majority of Americans through backdoor shenanigans of the like I have never contemplated occurring in Washington, much less seen.
This is a sad day for our Republic, whatever you may think of this bill.
And before all you Democrats get all giddy with your success, all this does is tell Republicans that if Democrats can rewrite the rule book to get a bill passed, Republicans can rewrite the rule book to revoke it.
This is not over. Trust me. This country just got significantly closer to violence in the streets. Significantly.
Well, looks like we’ve identified a designated hitman for squadron, Obama.
On the Army side, Cyrus, have you considered most 30 and under selected healthy men that were/are in the US Army didn’t and don’t really need a whole bunch of health care, unless of special circumstances related to wars.
Go figure.
So on the other hand, if you have less than 50 employees — and they don’t get medical insurance but the guvmint will provide, and the same healthy and disease free 19 and 20 year old working at Costco will gladly cough up money from their paycheck to cover other peoples illness’s.
Right, smack the 20 year olds at Costco, after all they’re screwing the system for being healthy. How dare they ?
Sorry, I missed the part about sucking money out of the local community. If I did that, it sure ain’t money related to my in desk.
Oh, and one more thing, if you think Republicans in the Senate are going to allow a single initiative from Obama to succeed for the rest of his Presidency, you are seriously naive about how Washington works. What you will see now in Washington is all out legislative war.
Congratulations Democrats, you have succeeded in wrecking this nation. Go have yourselves a beer.
http://www.frumforum.com/waterloo
No illusions please: This bill will not be repealed. Even if Republicans scored a 1994 style landslide in November, how many votes could we muster to re-open the “doughnut hole” and charge seniors more for prescription drugs? How many votes to re-allow insurers to rescind policies when they discover a pre-existing condition? How many votes to banish 25 year olds from their parents’ insurance coverage? And even if the votes were there – would President Obama sign such a repeal?
We followed the most radical voices in the party and the movement, and they led us to abject and irreversible defeat.
There were leaders who knew better, who would have liked to deal. But they were trapped. Conservative talkers on Fox and talk radio had whipped the Republican voting base into such a frenzy that deal-making was rendered impossible. How do you negotiate with somebody who wants to murder your grandmother? Or – more exactly – with somebody whom your voters have been persuaded to believe wants to murder their grandmother?
RogerR, as this country descends into ever more vicious partisanship over the next three years, I want you to remember how it all started. When the first conscientious objectors to forced purchase of insurance are sent to jail, I want you to remember which side of liberty you were on.
I’ll give you a hint. It wasn’t the right side.
Among other things, I predict a significant move towards a constitutional amendment to reverse this thing. Over thirty states have already proposed or passed legislation to challenge this on ninth amendment grounds.
You partisan greedy bastards really have no idea what you’ve just done.
You’ll learn though. You will learn.
You partisan greedy bastards really have no idea what you’ve just done.
Flattery will get you nowhere.
Laugh it up while you can RogerR. You will remember this day. I can guarantee it.
I may disagree with Dean, but this sky- is -falling mentality is sooo reminiscent of the Kos Kids and W and Iraq. Yes it is the same. It is neither healthy nor helps out this country. The reason why I come here (Dean’s World) is for balance. We are survivors here. If it (HCR)cturns out good, great. If it sucks, it will be adjusted. No matter what, all of us agree here that the status quo sucks.
Please do not take out your anger on Dean because you strongly disagree. some of us are on the uninsured dole and fall into our own doughnut holes of too much for medicare and can’t get insurance. So we’re (I’m skeptical of the current thing) looking for something to help us out. Dean’s been out of work for close to a year. Y’all would be thinking the same way too if you were in such a situation (I hope I’m not stepping on your toes, Mr. E :)
Here is an article done by Brett Arends of the WSJ. I think both sides need to chill and Arends provides some insight.
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Is-Socialized-Medicine-Bad-wallstreet-3689811386.html?x=0&.v=1
sabinal17,
Can you tell us what yer message was in language that is intelligible.
> Please do not take out your anger on Dean because you strongly disagree.
Why not?
> some of us are on the uninsured dole and fall into our own doughnut holes of too much for medicare and can’t get insurance.
Some of us will lose our jobs because of this bill. Caterpillar estimates it will cost them 100 million dollars the first year. Where will they get the money? Layoffs. So will the company I work for. Maybe even Dean’s new job will go away.
And here is the kicker. The assistance we are supposed to get from this bill won’t kick in for four years, but the mandates will. So, because of this bill people will be newly unemployed with newly rising insurance costs and no new government assistance.
The bill is brain dead. It will immediately make things worse.
Yours,
Tom
The difference between the “sky is falling” mentality of the Kos Kids over GW Bush and the “sky is falling” mentality of me and other conservatives over this abomination of a health bill and the manner in which it passed is that the Kos Kids were full of crap and we aren’t.
The proof will be in the results.
I say again, those of you who supported this travesty will remember this day and wonder how you ever supported the destruction of the best health care on this planet.
When you are waiting for months and months to see a doctor, when your private industry health insurance disappears to be replaced by government bureaucrats deciding what procedures you qualify for and when you see your “fair share” to pay for the health care of others go up year after year, you will think back to this day.
I cannot stress enough what a disaster the Democrats have just dumped on this country.
I still have hope that there will be ways to overcome this. Similar debacles have been reversed in the past. Hopefully this one will too. But it will be hard to do, unless Republicans are as fast and loose with the rules as Democrats have been.
There will be multiple challenges against this bill and some of them will succeed in whittling away portions of this monstrosity. But as long as the bulk of this remains in place, this nation is on a one-way path towards economic ruin. Which it was already, of course, but this will accelerate it significantly.
Democrats own this travesty. Lock stock and barrel. In the future whenever anyone fights an uncaring, inefficient and incompetent health care system, they will have only Democrats to blame.
Yeah, I like Dean’s sentiment, and I wish I wuz as hopeful as him, because I do think there problems with the status quo.
However…….
1. Tort reform to reduce defensive medicine;
2. De-link health insurance from your job (ie, tax credits directed to individuals who buy health insurance;
3. Tear down barriers to interstate competition
4. Some modest regulations about pre-existing conditions.
Something more modest would have been much better than a 2,000 page monstrosity, that nobody has read, and nobody really knows how it will play out.
–HB
1) The congressional Democrats will be dead meat this November.
2) Now that the Democrats lost their 60-vote filibuster killer in the Senate, there won’t be any more Obama legislation coming out of that house. Which means nobody is going to legalize the taxes needed to pay for this fiasco.
3) The bond rating of the United States will lose its AAA grade for the first time in memory.
4) I’ll make as much money selling insurance companies mailing lists of families with children at home turning 26, as I could have with the age limits still set at 23 or so.
5) Now you all are about to learn an interim lesson on what real inflation is like, until world peak oil comes and it will no longer be an interim lesson.
6) Medical care will be degraded by all the bureaucracy involved in delivering it.
Happy 21st century.
Arnold Harris
Mount Horeb WI
Dean, by supporting this, you have endorsed, but for the promise of a president who has an expiration date on every promise, federal funding for, and by extension, endorsement of abortion. Where that puts you religiously is between you, the Pope, and God.
The question is still outstanding, though, as to how many dead babies are worth keeping a random person from going into debt over a broken leg.
Oh yeah, now that the Democrats are braying so proudly about how they have “saved health care” people in this country who only pay attention to the daily sound bite are actually going to expect positive changes now when nothing but the bill for this thing kicks in for the next four years. So the initial result will be negative for the average person, not positive.
It will be a load of fun watching Democrats explain to the country that they made history while the average person only sees a larger insurance premium and still gets their insurance canceled for “pre-existing conditions”.
Four years is a long, long time in politics. Four years of Democrats desperately trying to tell people how good things are going to be if they can just wait. In the meantime, the job layoffs, increased taxes and increase in dropped insurance will pile up and all of it will be blamed on this legislation.
I repeat myself. Democrats have no idea what they’ve just done. No idea at all. They were in such a manic rush to win one for Obama and pat themselves on the back for a “piece of historic legislation” that they never once thought what would happen once this abomination became law.
Wait until the civil disobedience begins. Wait until millions of tax payers file extensions for their tax returns. Wait until millions more refuse to buy insurance they don’t need just to provide services for someone they don’t know. Wait until the first folks start going to jail, and state legislatures pass laws in direct opposition to this bill.
This fight has just begun.
“Well, looks like we’ve identified a designated hitman for squadron, Obama.”
You seem to have misplaced your tinfoil there, Mc Kiernan.
“On the Army side, Cyrus, have you considered most 30 and under selected healthy men that were/are in the US Army didn’t and don’t really need a whole bunch of health care, unless of special circumstances related to wars.”
Wrong. You have clearly never been in the military. The families of U.S service personnel receive on-base medical care from the military facilitates as MUCH as the service members themselves, if not more.
Bah.
Grow up. You DO sound like Kos kids. And your treatment of Dean – the blogmeister on this site where you so trash him – is disrespectful. I speak with respect and am insulted instead? That’s Kos speak.
> Grow up. You DO sound like Kos kids. And your treatment of Dean – the blogmeister on this site where you so trash him – is disrespectful. I speak with respect and am insulted instead? That’s Kos speak.
I’m not seeing Dean being disrespected or you being insulted, except in very mild terms.
Yours,
Tom
Comments on this entry are closed.